We are not Boca or River, nor do we want to be

The bottles of water are present, in quantity. But they do not beat the histrionic rhythm of the accelerated pulse of a game. There are no shouts, no indications - just a "go ahead, come this way" when you arrive - no wild goal celebrations. Of course, the grass is shiny, as if to play a perfect dive, but it is not a stadium but rather the privacy of Sebastián Beccacece's house. There, away from the noise of the city and several kilometers from the Obelisk, but not so many from Florencio Varela, the DT of Defense and Justice received Olé for a very extensive talk in the middle of the Holidays and after his announcement of continuity in the Hawk.

-Why do you stay in Defense?

-We had a lot of questions related to whether we will be able to reinvent ourselves, to meet the expectations that are generated in the people and the environment. Focusing only on that leads you to feel fear and you don't continue. More knowing the processes that occur in Defense, that footballers are leaving and we have to start practically from scratch. But we enjoy the day to day, we like to accompany that transformation of footballers, who arrive in one way and leave in another, you find reasons and reasons to give continuity to something that I think is worthwhile and that goes beyond the results.

-Defense this year achieved what they say cannot be done today: compete with the Brazilians. He beat two-time champion Palmeiras in the Americas twice and you said you have to keep dreaming… Can you go for more?

-In order to compete against the best teams and budgets, we have to go to the limit, give 100% every day. It is a maximum, total requirement. And since I know the locals and I know of their excessive dedication and true commitment, I encourage us to continue believing and dreaming. And at the same time I believe in the perseverance we have to continue building that dream, which sometimes becomes real. We look for perfection, but it does not exist. But looking for it helps you to walk… We have total passion, discipline and respect accompanied by humility. We do not aspire to be Boca or River, nor do we want to be, we are proud to represent this space, the minority.

-What is the formula to beat the powerful of Brazil?

-I don't know if formula, there are many events that influence. The first key is planning by the leadership, which demands credibility and coherence over time, with budget management, investment in works and a defined profile of coaches. Then there is our armor. They all have to unite, be very synchronized and with extreme conviction. To compete with those figures, which are monsters, you have to be very determined because we always start at a disadvantage. We cannot compare ourselves from resources, but we can from teamwork. We are strong there and football is collective. There is a temptation to go for the individual: the figure, the scorer, the coach and little is said about the importance of footballers who do not shine, but who are vital for their teammates to do so. That humility and generosity is what a coach has to work for... Everyone wants to be stars, but the group is necessary to be able to compete with the best.

Albertengo will play in Defense

-One could imagine that you are obsessive about soccer, that you spend your time watching videos, analyzing tactical issues. However, you have a much more sensitive side that leads you to worry about your players, their families, etc... Is there a wrong image about you?

-There are labels, we give everything a name, heh. I went through that stage of watching a lot, it's necessary to manage a lot of things and be able to solve in real time because you can't go to the video while it's playing. But later, once you've seen so much, naturally you feel able to observe, you feel confident and that allows you to tackle other issues to broaden your horizon as a driver. Over time I realized that football and life are totally linked, many of the things that happen to us during the 90 minutes or in the week are situations or sensations that happen to us on a daily basis in life, so I try to unite that and share it with the footballers, from whom I learn. Many times I am a reflection of what happens to them.

Close to the sparkling water of the pool and in the shade of a large umbrella that protects from UV rays and the oppressive heat, this young man (he turned 41 on 12/17) but experienced coach opened up to talk about everything and show his most intimate side . There were almost three hours shared between the note and the famous off, always with good vibes and even with moments of chat over coffee or after-dinner barbecue with friends. His daughters, Agustina (15) and Vicky (9), are in the family home with Pato, his wife, about whom he will say that he plays soccer but not because of his influence and, although the ball is not one of the usual trending topics of the house, it is his refuge. The place where he has the gym and a mini cinema, which he usually uses alone or with his loved ones, but always for his passions: cinema, theater (pandemic and streaming times) and analyzing rivals and matches own of him.

-And your attitude during the games? Because here we chat and they are calm, sensitive, thoughtful, but on the pitch… What happens to you when you see yourself?

-No, I don't see myself. But I recognize myself in that state because I am also that, I don't think we are one thing. In those moments I am that and maybe it is the version that I like the least, but I do not deny it. On the contrary, I accept it. I grew up in a time of selfishness and of winning as it may be, and I am also rooted in all those things... I like more the reflective state, being able to speak, and not the one in which I am in competition mode and, on the outside, I give what worst of me But I always say, as long as it's genuine and respectful, fine. Also, in five years I was only expelled once and unfairly because I didn't do anything, which was now, when Iván (Delfino), who immediately apologized, came and grabbed me in a crazy way. Even my teams do not show those sensations of madness, but the opposite: they show maturity, growth...

-Will you manage to disconnect from the madness of football at some point?

-It is difficult for me because I am a seeker all the time, I have one thing and I want another. I have an obsession with an infinite, instinctive and natural search, that's why it's hard for me. What distracts me? Watch a movie with my wife and my daughters… But, ultimately, I'm still looking, because when that movie ends I keep thinking about how I can use it for life, for a chat with friends or if I'm going to visit a children's dining room.

Do you like to participate in social activities of that type?

-Yes, I grew up in a neighborhood of Rosario where all of this was very present, where the aim was to get kids off the street and bring them closer to neighborhood clubs. Fighter is called my club, in the West Zone of Rosario, and it always had that culture. I have visited prisons as well. I have a social tendency, I guess it must be because of the clubs I went to, the neighborhood and the public school that I had to go through...

-Do you apply that social side to football? Is it useful for you to work with schools like Defense, with many young people?

-Totally! Defense has a lot of that. The player has had to go through many things, living in different pensions, around 12 years old having to go away from his parents, missing such a beautiful, deep and marking stage, such as adolescence... And all to try to be professional. To treat, eh, because we know that many fall by the wayside. Then there are traumas. The coach's job is infinite and when you get involved from the heart, you try to turn things around, share and get the best out of 30 people. How do you go about disconnecting then? There is also the extreme demand of Argentine football, that you cannot be distracted on the side or on a long ball...

-You have a well-defined style, but have you ever praised Simeone's defensive work, for example...

-I think there are the coaches who organize themselves from the ball and those who do it without it, giving possession to the rival. We try to do it from the ball, but there are others who feel much more comfortable the other way around, putting together highly organized defensive structures, some of them brilliant, and when they go against them they find more space. It is very difficult to say this team is this… There may be a tendency, but sometimes we are also dominated and we must show a defensive organization to withstand those attacks. It is clear that we spend more time working on how to start, how to look for variables from the ball or how to combine passes; but the other is there too. I think anything goes in football...

-In other words, isn't there such a thing as a defensive or offensive coach?

-They exist for the medium. Afterwards, one feels one thing and others feel another, and there is no need to deny that because everything is drinkable. As Bielsa says, when they put a table of coaches and divide them by their style, more or less they earned the same. The issue is what you feel, what you like… Why, if I want an idea, do I have to denigrate the other? I may not carry it out, but I respect it.

-You talked about ideas and conviction, why do you think you couldn't install all that in Independiente?

-Because we were there for a very short time, we were left out of the Sudamericana and the Copa Argentina, and they told us to leave. It's that simple. There is a great demand for results in those clubs, we had 68% of the points, but the leadership believed that and that's it. There was no patience or conviction for us to move on… We have to accept the decisions that we don't like and I appreciate that they have sought us out.

-And in Racing you had to pay the internal politics and you went with Milito...

-Yes, it was a very happy year that I lived in Racing because I was able to develop what we did in Defense but with the transcendence of a big club and there a lot of myths fell, like that it couldn't reach the big players... When We faced him with Defense, 20 players came to greet us and, later, what Lisando (López) and Darío (Cvitanich) declared, that he played little. That for me is a pride because it speaks of the work of the entire coaching staff, those are the medals that we coaches have left. But, coming back, we did suffer a lot during the political year of Racing and the internal one that if Milito continued there was a sector that was not going to continue. It was a power struggle in which I was not going to get involved, I was a very gentleman, I never said anything and I banished the lies that they installed, that of the fights...

-Why didn't you deny it?

-I will never go out and deny the lie because I understand the role of interest generated by football, the political thread, the money that is at stake... I am not oblivious to that, but I dedicate myself to working in my space, with the squad and everyone the employees who were with us. And we had a wonderful time. But, unfortunately, sometimes you have to travel places where interest plays and is above what is being developed. And you can't even hope to control that...

- In the soccer thing it did not go bad to you?

-No, we arrived being 12 in the table, we directed 11 games and finished third, putting the team in Libertadores. And all playing in a totally different way in a short time, in a team that came from being champion. That's why, that they come to say that they kicked us out, it's a lie; that we had no results, another big lie! We left Flamengo out, we won important classics, we showed an idea and we got a high percentage of points. We were one goal away from putting Racing in a final after 21 years. But, well, if politics, which has access to the mass media, installs this thread all the time... what can one do? The important thing is the expression of the people who, when we went to the Cylinder, shouted for us and the players, who came to greet us...

The transfer market: high, low and possible reinforcements

-So you left out of loyalty to Milito when he left. Like you did with Sampaoli when you left the National Team or when you said no to Bielsa...

-My relationship with Diego is extraordinary and I would never have stayed, not because I didn't want to, but because I think it was the right thing to do. But he had a beautiful love for the players, an extraordinary bond with the people and with Víctor (Blanco) also a very good relationship. I think it's something that I bring from my family, I was raised that way. For me the value of words and actions count, so I have to be consistent with what I say. In 2007, when Jorge (Sampaoli) kicked us out of Sporting Cristal and Marcelo called me to be part of a new coaching staff or in other places, from which Jorge was leaving and they offered me to stay. Enchanted tomorrow, I don't close the door to being in a place where I was, but today I came with him and I'm leaving with him. That things happen on their own merit and not because they knew me through someone who took me to work in that place...

-And what did Bielsa tell you when you told him no?

-He understood me because Marcelo is a person of brilliance that everyone knows, but with a unique sensitivity that perhaps not many know. All this happened when we were in Chile, he was in the national team and we were in O'Higgins. It was a time when my old man was not well, and after a year I had to lose him, and Marcelo accompanied me in that process. In fact, when I went back to Argentina because my old man wasn't well, I met Bielsa on the plane and we had a very deep and nice talk. I don't want to tell intimacies, but I do want to show that cute side of him. And when he called me, I did what he felt, what ethics and morals indicated to me, that's why he understood it. And I don't regret it. We followed the link, I learned a lot from him and I am eternally grateful because he gave me a lot of information and shared things with me. Each one, later, forges his style, but he was a great inspiration for our generation and also for future ones.

-Do you dream of directing Newell's, a club of which you are a fan?

-It is one of the reasons why I started and at various times the possibility came. First being with Jorge and then as head coach, but we were always carrying out processes. Also, you have to be willing to lose the passion. Today I sit down to see Newell's as a fan, not as a coach. Before I was convinced that one day I was going to direct it, but today I feel like I want to take care of that place. There is a very deep feeling, linked to infinite stories, to doing crazy things for Newell's... From running away from school to go to Buenos Aires to watch a game to staying focused and not going out one night to go the next day to support with more enthusiasm, heh .

-Today, with the passage of time, do you understand what happened in the World Cup in Russia?

-I think that the urgency of the result and the short time we were there meant that the idea could not be developed. We had to qualify quickly for the World Cup and we did it to the limit. If we didn't get it, it would have been something terrifying for the country but especially for the boys who had been in the National Team for 16 years. Perhaps, if that liberation that occurred when winning the Copa América had happened before, as in the Sabella stage, which they deserved, today we would be talking about something else. All that tension was obviously not managed, it is clear in the results; but I wasn't the driver and that's why talking about this makes me uncomfortable. I feel that he was not up to the task... The coach will explain it publicly if he wants to, or he will keep it to himself.

-Would you like to return to the National Team, but in this role of main coach?

-I like the National Team because they are all for the essence of defending the shield, it is the most amateur thing there is and I am passionate about that. The junction point is guaranteed and there you already have gained ground. Afterwards, it is true that there is little time for day-to-day work, for knowledge, but today with technology it is much easier. The truth is that it is something very beautiful, in any selection. What I experienced in Chile, with that connection with the people, was something beautiful, and I am not Chilean...

-Did the National Team change with the renewal of players?

-No, the difference is that they won and they look for these things to explain it, but Leo, Ángel, Otamendi and Kun continue until recently. And the other boys also had and have that fanaticism but since they didn't win, they were labeled in another way in history. El Pipa, Mascherano, Biglia, gave and gave everything, but that demand for success and that the one who doesn't win is a failure, pushes you away and creates discomfort. A feeling of little value… There is also wear and tear, it was 16 years for all of them. But look at what a nice example: if Leo, number one, had to work so hard to achieve what he dreamed of, why aren't we going to do it... You have to see the positive side, but the road is painful. Leo's faces, everything he's had to go through, accompanied by tremendous pain. Who is willing to go through that pain to achieve what he wants? This is what this profession puts us to the test.

-Did you talk to Leo after the Cup?

-Lately I haven't talked to Leo, but to Kun. I also congratulated Pablo (Aimar), (Alejandro) Tocalli, Chiqui (Tapia) and some other players. I also sent Leo a message. In that short time that I was there, I realized all the pain and the heavy burden that he carried of being the best and that he was not given. He carried the entire backpack. All.

The social side of him and how he transfers it to the day to day with the campuses

“We are all the time exchanging ideas, debating, growing and learning from the players. The technician must connect with that energy that the group has, feel what is happening to the other in order to empathize, know how the family is integrated, what problems it has, what situations it is going through, how it is in its emotional and material plane. It's not just strategic”, Beccacece blurts out, talking about something that many times in football they turn their backs on.

But he is not alone in that and as he progresses he mixes it with the ball. What is the incidence that emotional issues from the past or the present can have in a match situation? “Sometimes a player doesn't dare to do something because of limiting beliefs that come from his childhood or an event that marked him and he must face that fear. I believe that if one is capable of receiving and processing that information, it can provide the other with a tool to unlock situations. I like this a lot".

-Do you know the life of each of your soccer players on campus?

-Nerd. It would be impossible. But with Guille (Marino), Nico (Diez) and the working group we took the time to talk. It is common for us to chat with them after training and then tell each other the information. We have also invited the parents or gone to eat a barbecue at the boys' house. We hold more collective meetings...

-Is this issue with the families of the players something normal in football or something specific to you and your collaborators?

-I believe that it happens, that it is more normal than it is believed. It is part of the bond that gives you the opportunity to show us vulnerability, show our anxieties and fears, and that makes us stronger. Then he moves to the field and we show the courage and rebellion to go to the Monumental and stand as equals, to face Palmeiras or to play a Libertadores and qualify the club for the first time to the round of 16. Obviously there are fears and uncertainty in this process, but they must be transformed. Anyone who says that he has no anguish or doubts... I'm not saying that it doesn't happen, but I'm suspicious because I think that, more or less, the same thing happens to all of us. They are human feelings, but for a cultural issue, of imposition, they always had to hide and be macho. I think that brave is the one who faces his fears, who goes to a certain scenario, stands up and solves it.

The new litter of young coaches without an outstanding career as players

“I started with Jorge (Sampaoli), who was not successful either, and we did it together. We talk about conviction. They are prejudices from the outside. Inside, with the players, in ten minutes everything can go deep or fall. The footballer is very intuitive and looks at the knowledge, ability and credibility that you have. It was never difficult for me to transmit because I know what I feel and think, I have no prejudices. We are in a time where, luckily, more space is given to diversity, to those who think differently, and from that we learn. Now, obviously, one has to follow the path of what one feels and when it comes to conveying an idea there are non-negotiable things and in that we also have to be direct, because if we do not get into a situation in which it is difficult to drive and agree agreement. But, if you are convinced that what the other person says is good for the group, then I agree with it”, he explains.

-And what things are non-negotiable for you?

-What you feel. If we are going to do this and you don't like it, it's someone else's problem, you leave… The way of moving, from values, when developing an idea. Opposing ideas are good to open questions, but there has to be a sign that both sides make an effort to accept each other, give 100% to get closer to the other.

Beccace and the intimacy of her family

The Defense coach shares life with Pato, whom they met while studying Physical Education Teacher Training. Today they carry on the family that is completed with Vicky, nine years old, and Agustina, 15. “We talk a lot with them. I think that with love and support is the basis for anything with the boys. And from there, talks are generated as in any family: debating and explaining things always from acceptance, ”says Becca about the role of his father.

-What do they tell you when they see you crazy on the court?

-They also compete, they do horse riding, and when things don't work out they also get bitter, suffer and want to win. As it happens to the whole society because we are part of it. What do we do? First we become aware that we have these things and we try to reflect to see how we can go through it more healthily, because ultimately that does not end up being very healthy. Think about how to polish it. Already the fact of fighting it is a battle won. Later, the environment, what is installed, takes hold of one, connects and lets go with that high energy, of a lot of frustration and anger. One channels many things that are happening and then somehow they come out... At home we have a lot of privacy, tranquility and, as in all families, there are spaces for madness but from the affectionate and loving side. Love is the best source of energy, when there is love everything can be done and with children it is the greatest love we have in life, so it doesn't cost much...

-Do they go to the field to accompany you or because they like soccer?

-Pato plays soccer, so he goes because he is passionate about it and, as in all processes, also to accompany me. Agus had to travel to Peru when he was two months old and Vicky was born in Chile. They accompanied me throughout the race and we are learning as a family what it is like to change places, cultures and beliefs. We learn from life walking together.

-Pato plays soccer because of your influence?

-Nerd. We met at the PE teacher and he is very apt at sports.

-Is there a football debate in the after-dinner conversations?

-No, no, never. With my old man, when he was alive, a little yes, ha. The truth is that at home we respect spaces a lot. There I try to take off the coach's suit and talk about the things that happen to them. And if they see me in a state of solitude, they respect that space. Agus imitates me very well, he knows when I am leaving, when I am coming… he recognizes Me right away. The boys are very intelligent, they take you out on the touch no matter how much you talk to them. The new generations come with a different brain, they come with a different development, we have to learn from them.

-Did your brothers play or are linked to football?

-Aníbal, my twin, was an organized midfielder and played a couple of games at Central Córdoba, in the B Nacional. And Federico, the youngest but who was the tallest, also played in that position and later as a central defender in the Primera de Juan XXIII, one of the clubs that my old man took us to when we were kids. But today they are not linked to soccer, they consume like all normal fans, but they have a clothing business in a shopping mall in Rosario.

-Are they very similar to Aníbal? Does it happen to him that walking through Rosario they confuse him with you?

-No, at one point we were more similar, we both had long hair. Today we look like brothers, but not twins. You realize that there is a link on the physical side, but we are not a carbon copy like Barros Schelotto.

The great year of Defense

-Which do you think was the best Argentine team of the year?

-(Thinks for a few seconds). The truth is that there were many teams... I think that in the last stage River and Defense played very nice football, both with results. I think the first part of ours was beautiful because we showed a continuous level also internationally, we won the Recopa… In that game, in those 90 minutes, I went through all the emotions. They are those games that are marked by the emotion generated by the spectator, who has a routine life in which he works ten hours a day and in 120 minutes everything that did not happen that day was mobilized. That is great. The Defense year has been incredible, it will be unforgettable in time. Obviously it also happens that we are in a place that has less publicity and that of the other clubs seems greater, as if it does not happen there, it is not valid. I do not agree with that, but I respect that it is installed like this...

Argentine football voted for the great champion of 2021

-Is Defense a bit underrated sometimes?

-There are a lot of teams that had good and beautiful moments. But everything is centralized in football, as is the case with Argentina and Buenos Aires. We are a reflection of the country, we are not alien to that. It is very centralized in Boca and River, and we are not here to change that. The whole story happened and will continue to happen, but it is good that the debate is taking place. We come to transmit what we feel, it would be good if it opens up a bit... As it is sometimes said, those from the South also feel. The other day I met with the Mayor of Varela, Andrés Watson, and he told me something that is very good to know: Varela is the municipality with the fewest resources in Greater Buenos Aires. How is it done to manage it? And in Defense that also happens a bit. How do we manage with the scarcity of resources? And so we reach the elite, how can it not be valued? And that remains for analysis. He is also all armed with what he sells, obviously Boca and River are the ones with the most fans and you have to go there, it is a whole system, of which we are not oblivious and we understand it. It seems to me that starting from scarcity and reaching the elite deserves recognition. As I said before, we are not Boca or River nor do we want to be. We are proud to be Defense, which must be promoted because it is a space of opportunity. Not from the other, because we are not. For this reason, in a world sometimes unfair for the opportunity, Defense deserves recognition.

Its beginnings and the journey to Peru: three days in a semi-bed micro

Being almost a teenager, Sebastián Beccacece stopped playing right back to turn to the technical direction. He began working in the youth categories of Renato Cesarini, a historic Rosario club from which great glories of our football have come. However, the great opportunity came through Claudio Vivas, who introduced him to Jorge Sampaoli, then the coach of Sport Boys in Peru, who was looking to add a collaborator to his work team. At the age of 22, Becca packed her bag and set out on a journey to the Province of Callao.

-The story that you went by bus is well known. But why? Was there no money for the plane?

-First I had the plane ticket, which at that time, in 2003, was worth 500 dollars, it was accessible to few. Later, cheaper rates began to come out. There was no internet and cell phones were just coming out, it was all very complicated. I remember that when Jorge called me, he had to go to a long distance phone. He told me that he had lost a match and that they were going to kick him out, that he return the ticket. And we had been talking a lot, I was very excited, it was an opportunity that I had been waiting for three years... It was a hard blow to know that it was not going to happen, but I did not stay with it, I rebelled. I told him: “Don't worry, I'll return the ticket, but the bus ticket is worth 100 dollars and if I arrive and you're not there, nothing happens”. Those three days that the bus trip lasted we were going to be incommunicado. Just a day and a half later, when we stopped in Chile, I found a phone. First I called my family and Pato to keep them calm. And then I called him. I told him that he was halfway there and he told me that they would be waiting for me at the terminal. When I arrived, the terminals were not like here but like a shed and on top of that the person who came to pick me up was late... So after traveling three days in the same bus, without being able to take a shower and with two bags full of things, I had it to wait 40 minutes, heh. On top of that I was carrying everything because I didn't know what I was going to find. Jorge had told me: "let's see where you can stay, if with a player...". The truth is that, if he thought about it, he wasn't going. It is the beauty of youth, of rebellion, with which I feel identified and it is very transformative if it is used in a good way.

Was it a sleeping car at least?

-No, no, semi bed, ha. I arrived delicate, but when one goes with so much passion... We chatted with some of the micro... As I told you, today it is very easy to have contact with everyone, I had to go to a cyber every night there and first agree with my family to connect. I was traveling two hours round trip to go to the training place, at ten at night I connected, at 11 I put Pone a Francella, which was shown on a Peruvian channel, and that was my life. Traté de mantenerme arraigado a la familia, a los amigos ya Pato, que en ese entonces era mi novia, mientras trabajaba en el profesionalismo.

-¿Alguna vez te arrepentiste de hacer toda esa locura?

-Fueron años difíciles, pero no me arrepiento porque así como el futbolista tiene un camino muy duro para llegar a lo que hoy disfruta; el entrenador cuando empieza muy de abajo, como me pasó, de trabajar en la formación, en Inferiores, y transitar todo esto que estoy contando, es todo terreno ganado. Hay que soportar mucho en esta profesión, que está expuesta, que te tiene todo el tiempo al límite, que te juzgan de lo que hiciste, de lo que no, de lo que sos y de lo que no sos. Que inventan cosas... La tranquilidad, esa fuerza interior, está en el camino recorrido.

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